Walter is a 2-year-old male-neutered labrador retriever who has presented on Saturday morning at the emergency clinic. He is having a little bit of vomiting and a LOT of diarrhea. Dr. Andy Roark wrestles with wanting to be aggressive enough to solve Walter’s problem quickly while also wanting to be a good steward for antimicrobials and to not throw more medications at the problem than it warrants. He’s looking for advice and turns to emergency veterinarian Dr. Callie Harris. Dr. Harris works with Purina ProPlan Veterinary Supplements and shares some fantastic tips, tricks and ways of thinking to help do what’s best for Walter and his owners. Let’s get into this episode!
This podcast was brought to you ad-free by Purina ProPlan Veterinary Supplements.
LINKS
Purina Institute – www.purinainstitute.com/
Dr. Callie’s IG: @dr.callieh
UNCHARTED APRIL CONFERENCE:
unchartedvet.com/uncharted-april-2022/
Charming the Angry Client On-Demand Staff Training: drandyroark.com/on-demand-staff-training/
What’s on my Scrubs?! Card Game: drandyroark.com/training-tools/
Dr. Andy Roark Swag: drandyroark.com/shop
All Links: linktr.ee/DrAndyRoark
ABOUT OUR GUEST
Dr. Callie Harris is a 2008 graduate of Tuskegee University’s School of Veterinary Medicine. After graduation, she completed a one- year rotating small animal internship at the Veterinary Specialty Hospital of the Carolinas in Cary, NC. During her internship, she developed a love for emergency medicine and critical care and worked as an emergency veterinarian at Cobb and Cherokee Emergency Veterinary Clinics, which are fast-paced, high volume specialty practices in Metro-Atlanta since 2009. In December of 2016, Dr. Callie Harris joined Nestle Purina PetCare as a full-time veterinarian. In her role as Senior Veterinary Communications Manager, she provides support for veterinary teaching hospitals throughout the Southeast and technical education support for Purina’s veterinary sales division. She also works closely with Purina Brand and Public Relations by participating in various media platforms to connect with the veterinary and pet loving communities.
Callie has a special interest in emergency medicine, ultrasound, and nutrition. She loves working with a variety of cases and meeting clients from all walks of life. She currently resides in Atlanta Georgia with her husband, toddler daughter, her hyper Bichon/Poodle mix and a senior citizen terrier mix. When Callie is not working, you can find her on the dance floor! She is a former part-time ballroom dance instructor in Buckhead. Most recently, she joined the cast of ABC’s Pooch Perfect as a co-judge of a creative grooming reality contest and to provide veterinary consultation. In her spare time, she loves to travel and read!
EPISODE TRANSCRIPT
Dr Andy Roark:
Welcome everybody to The Cone of Shame veterinary podcast. My name is Dr Andy Roark. I am your host, guys. I am glad that you are here. Today I am talking with the one and only Dr. Callie Harris on acute canine diarrhea on emergency. Are probiotics enough? This is a super useful, super practical podcast. I got a lot out of this. Yeah, it changed the way I look at some of the most common emergency cases I see which is the acute onset diarrhea cases. Guys, this podcast is brought to you ad free by Purina Pro Plan Professional Supplements. Gang, let’s get into this episode.
Kelsey Beth Carpenter:
(singing) This is your show, we’re glad you’re here, we want to help you in your veterinary career. Welcome to the Cone of Shame with Dr. Andy Roark.
Dr Andy Roark:
Welcome to the podcast Dr. Callie Harris. How are you?
Dr. Callie Harris:
I’m doing great, Andy. Thank you so much for having me.
Dr Andy Roark:
It’s my pleasure. Thanks a lot for being here. I have a case that I think you would be perfect for and I’d like to get a little coaching on it. Sound good?
Dr. Callie Harris:
That sounds great. I can’t wait.
Dr Andy Roark:
So for those who do not know you, you are a veterinarian with Purina. You are a practicing emergency veterinarian.
Dr. Callie Harris:
That is correct.
Dr Andy Roark:
And that is the nature of the case that I have. So I want to talk to you about the acute onset diarrhea emergency case. So it’s Saturday I have Walter, the two-year-old male, neutered Labrador retriever who has come into the clinic. He has got acute onset, a lot of diarrhea. He had one bout of vomiting, like, last night he threw up a little bit but mostly it’s a lot of diarrhea and looking at this dog, the first thing I did, saying he’s a two year old Lab, I took some X-rays. Mom says, “You know, he’ll eat whatever.”
Dr. Callie Harris:
Sure.
Dr Andy Roark:
But she didn’t think he’s gotten into anything. She’s flummoxed but she’s, “I don’t know of anything.” He’s not obstructed. I don’t see any sort of sign of obstruction. I’m betting this is some type of dietary problem but I don’t really know. Also, I want to be gentle with Walter here too. I’m not trying to throw everything but the kitchen sink at him and at the same time it’s Saturday and I don’t want him to have to tough out the rest of the weekend with a therapy that’s not getting the job done.
Dr. Callie Harris:
Yeah.
Dr Andy Roark:
And so I’m trying to balance those two things of not going hog wild but at the same time also taking care of Walter and making sure they have a good rest of their weekend.
Dr. Callie Harris:
Right.
Dr Andy Roark:
So let me just hand this case to you at this point and just say, “Callie, how do you approach this? How do you treat this case?
Dr. Callie Harris:
Yeah. Well, Andy, this case I think all of us can relate to and it always seems to happen on Saturday mornings, right? And you already mentioned my background is in emergency medicine so I’m working tirelessly just like all my other colleagues in general practice, as well as ER, trying to manage these types of scenarios in a quick fashion, an effective fashion and a way, as you already called it, to where I can provide some relief, especially over the weekend. So let’s talk specifically about little Walter here. Walter is this bouncing, happy Labrador retriever that’s young. The first step that I’m always going to make, you’ve already done the diagnostics, but I always like to dig a little bit deeper into that pet’s nutrition history, right? Got to ask some questions.
Dr Andy Roark:
I got it.
Dr. Callie Harris:
So I think one of the common mistakes that I used to make earlier on in my career is I always asked these vomiting, diarrhea, patients or clients, “Hey, have you made a change to their diet? Has there been any type of diet change that led to the onset of these symptoms?” And a lot of times their answer would have been, “No.”
Dr Andy Roark:
Is, “No.” Yeah.
Dr. Callie Harris:
Yeah. What I’ve determined is that we have to be more specific. So I like to ask, “What type of food is Walter eating? How long has he been eating it? Does Walter like to get into maybe some table scraps? Does Walter, this two-year-old Labrador retriever, does he have a history of getting into the trash? Do you have any young, tiny humans in your household?” Do you know where I’m going with this?
Dr Andy Roark:
Mm-hmm (affirmative), yeah.
Dr. Callie Harris:
Well let’s even take it a step further. Did Walter go visit some friends recently? Or does Walter go to doggy daycare? All of this just provides a little bit more insight for the client to say, “Huh, now that you mention it, he might have had access to a different type of treat or he might have been fed a different food unbeknownst to me.” So I always like to start with that.
Dr. Callie Harris:
Now, after diagnostics, I am so happy that Walter is not obstructed because that’s the last thing I want to find on a Saturday morning. And you mentioned it, Andy, he’s only vomited once, he’s otherwise, on my physical exam, bright and alert, responsive. Hydration is fairly stable. So then I’m going to say, “Let’s try to manage the vomiting.” And for many of us that might be, “Hey, just hold off from feeding him anything,” for however many hours. Or maybe we take it a step further, want to give him a little bit of relief with an antiemetic or something that helps settle that stomach. But now let’s focus in on that lot of diarrhea that you just mentioned. How are we going to impact it? And that’s where I would go next.
Dr Andy Roark:
Okay, well, hold on, let me ask you a follow-up question here. So, we go through, and I like the way you approach this because, again, I’m completely with you, we ask people, “Did you feed him anything different?” And they a hundred percent just think about dog food and they’re like, “Nope.” And those are often not productive. How do you put that information to use, right? So when they come back and they say, “Well, I don’t know. He might have gotten some treats from the neighbor,” or things like that, does that change how you are approaching this? Does that make you feel better. I mean, if we still got copious amounts of diarrhea how does that affect where we go? What am I looking for in that information really?
Dr. Callie Harris:
Where that affects me is because of this pattern that has come in, with this acute onset of GI, particularly the diarrhea, I want to figure out if it fits into certain categories where I feel like a probiotic is going to be beneficial for this dog.
Dr Andy Roark:
Okay.
Dr. Callie Harris:
And some of those categories. We already know stress is at the top of the list. Any type of change in environment, dietary change, which again, doesn’t just mean you’ve switched the diet. That means we could have introduced some table scraps, introduced a different treat or what have you. That’s why I like to ask those questions because I’m making more of a case for the benefit of utilizing a probiotic.
Dr Andy Roark:
Okay. Unpack that for me because this is honestly something I’ve never thought about, this categorical approach. So can you break it down for me? So you said stress, you said dietary changes, are there other things specifically that you feel like, “Oh, these are things that…” Does that mean when you say it’s a good case for a probiotic that this is something that you anticipate you’re going to get a stronger, better response to as opposed to other types of cases?
Dr. Callie Harris:
How I look at it is that we know that our pets can be impacted by stress where it’s going to change their intestinal environment, right?
Dr Andy Roark:
Okay, sure.
Dr. Callie Harris:
Like whatever’s happening at the GI tract. But what people don’t realize is that stress can be all-encompassing. It could be the diet change. It could be us adding in a new medication. It could also be just age related changing. I don’t know if you know this but getting old can be stressful, I [crosstalk 00:07:16].
Dr Andy Roark:
I’ve heard, I’ve heard.
Dr. Callie Harris:
Well, even for our pets, that can be a contributing factor. And so I like to compartmentalize it like that because we know that if there is a shift in the bacteria within the intestinal tract, that there’s some sort of an imbalance, that’s exactly why a probiotic is going to be so powerful and so helpful. And so I am expecting it to be a problem solver potentially for these guys.
Dr Andy Roark:
Okay. All right. I like it. That’s super helpful. Okay. That helps me understand where we’re going and how we’re unpacking this. Great. I’m going to come back to that. So you’ve gotten this information, we’re going to come back to how we communicate this to the pet owner in a way that’s going to most likely get them to buy into what we’re doing and we’ll get some compliance here. So, okay. So we’ve gotten through this, we’ve sort of asked our opening questions, things like that. Let’s say that we don’t see signs of pancreatitis, things like that. We’re just dealing with gastroenteritis. What are your go-tos as far as therapy here and how do you start to approach this?
Dr Andy Roark:
So, let’s say it’s a diet change, it’s something, some new kind of food he’s gotten into, the neighbor’s had the cat food out, things like that. What are the building blocks that you lay down? I’ve always looked at probiotics [inaudible 00:08:26] brought up, I’ve always looked at that as a supplement. What are your building blocks? Is that the last thing we add on? Is that kind of a little thing? Is that a central piece of your treatment approach? Help me see what tools you get out of your toolbox because I want to make sure that I have those tools.
Dr. Callie Harris:
Andy, you are asking all the right questions and very similar to the conversations I have with my own vet colleagues, right?
Dr Andy Roark:
Right.
Dr. Callie Harris:
So I want us all to start looking at probiotics as an essential tool in our toolkit, not just as an afterthought, not as just a, “Oh, well, this is something that you can pick up from your local grocery store or Amazon,” or what have you, and there’s nothing wrong with going to those places, but I want really start to put this at the center of a lot of things that we do and it doesn’t mean that we’re only going to be managing with probiotics. There may be a layering opportunity. We might have to intervene with some other medical management scenarios but I do want us to get more in the mindset of looking at probiotics as an essential part of our management, especially with these acute onset GI patients.
Dr Andy Roark:
Okay. Okay, I hear that. So start laying it down for me. So what are you kind of reaching for? What are you reaching for? And then how do you start to present these things to the pet owner to get them to buy into this plan?
Dr. Callie Harris:
Yeah. So for Walter, okay, he only had that one bout of vomiting. So, as we mentioned before, we may decide to manage that, right? So give him something to help control the nausea potentially or maybe I just give the recommendation at home. Let’s just hold off from feeding anything by mouth for Walter. Depending on his hydration status, I may make the decision to add in some sort of fluid therapy or, again, make some different decisions based upon his level of need.
Dr. Callie Harris:
And then when it’s time for us to go home and I’m talking to the client about continued management for this diarrhea, first of all I investigate with the client how much is a lot of diarrhea and if they are describing to me that, “Okay, he got me up many times throughout the night to go outside, but he was able to hold it, he was able to make it to outdoors,” that’s one category, versus if they’re telling me that, “My entire living room was sprayed with diarrhea and he was having accidents in the house,” then that puts him in a different category as far as my decision making on how I want to intervene, how I want to layer. Let’s say it’s a typical case where he just had a lot of frequent bouts to having to go outside.
Dr Andy Roark:
Yeah. He was crying at the door a lot. Okay, cool.
Dr. Callie Harris:
Crying at the door a lot. Then I am going to encourage the start of a probiotic. Why am I talking about probiotics in these particular scenarios? What do we like about probiotics? What is a probiotic, for your listeners? Most of us know that it’s beneficial bacteria that we can provide to our patients, provide to ourselves, to help optimize overall gut health, to potentially replace what may be lost in the event of some sort of a disease state but there’s so many great roles that probiotics play.
Dr. Callie Harris:
When I think about giving a probiotic to my patient, I’m expecting it to do about three things. I want it to first of all arrive alive into the colon, into the gut, right, an area of maximum impact.
Dr Andy Roark:
Okay.
Dr. Callie Harris:
I want it to, if you don’t remember anything from this conversation, I want it to create, compete and produce. Create some sort of a physical barrier, compete with bad guys in the gut for nutrients and for space, and then produce other antimicrobial substances that are going to also provide overall gut health. So when you think about the mechanism of action of probiotics, you can see now why it would be very helpful for this to be an essential part of our management for these diarrheal patients. These guys, when they’re coming in and they have some sort of trigger or onset, whether it’s dietary or stress or what have you, we can almost expect there’s been a shift in balance in their gut and so that’s why we’ve got to help optimize it and replace what may be lost.
Dr Andy Roark:
Okay. I really like how you think in categories. This is super helpful. I like how you split this up. So in category one, crying to go outside, needs to make multiple trips, things like that. Category two, it’s bad, it’s everywhere. How does that change your treatment approach?
Dr. Callie Harris:
So this is going to be the ER vet talking, right?
Dr Andy Roark:
Yeah, sure. That’s what I mean. Yeah.
Dr. Callie Harris:
This is going to be the ER vet and I’m going to preface by saying that there are a lot of different opinions on whether or not to utilize antimicrobials with diarrhea, right?
Dr Andy Roark:
Yep.
Dr. Callie Harris:
So from an ER standpoint with exactly the case that you started this off with, right?
Dr Andy Roark:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Dr. Callie Harris:
If I have the response that Walter has sprayed the walls of the clients living room, then I’m going to likely partner up my probiotic with an antimicrobial that we commonly use, metronidazole. And I feel comfortable and confident with doing that because there have been studies to demonstrate that when you partner up metronidazole with a very specific probiotic that contains Enterococcus faecium SF68, which is what’s in a probiotic, so hopefully all of us are aware of [inaudible 00:13:56] flora.
Dr Andy Roark:
Yep.
Dr. Callie Harris:
There has been evidence to support that the combination of the two can actually reduce the amount of days it takes for resolution of diarrhea.
Dr Andy Roark:
Okay.
Dr. Callie Harris:
So that would be that category, the one where they’re spraying the wall, then I know that I need to do more of a layering effect. The one where it’s like, “Yeah, he’s otherwise bright and alert seems to be okay, just needs to go outside more often,” then I feel like we have more of an opportunity to just lead in with the probiotic and supportive care for the other signs.
Dr Andy Roark:
Okay. One of the things that I need your help with, I need you to put me at ease a little bit here. I’ll be honest. It comes on as sort of expectations for reaching for probiotics and stuff to treat diarrhea. As I said at the beginning, I’m worried about sending this dog home on Saturday and being like, “Here’s a probiotic.” And then Sunday comes and they’re like, “This is still terrible.” I mean what are the expectations of therapy?
Dr Andy Roark:
So I’ve got Walter and let’s just say he’s in category one. So category one is… Because this is why I like your categories. So for me, I’ll be honest, on Saturday this person comes in, Walter’s in here, I don’t want him to have a bad weekend, I’m looking at metronidazole probiotic combination real hard and going, “I’m probably not going to regret if I do this,” but I do have this nagging voice in the back of my head about antimicrobial stewardship. You know what I mean? I feel bad. I don’t want to send everybody home with antibiotics and I don’t want to use them if I don’t need to. And so then I’m really, I’m just being totally honest and transparent with you here, I stand on the edge and I go, “Am I going to regret not doing this, or am I going to regret doing this?” Help me feel better about sending that dog home with just a probiotic. I mean, help me feel better because I’m going to be honest [crosstalk 00:15:35].
Dr. Callie Harris:
I support you on this, Andy, I can help absolutely support you. So number one, let’s just take a step back and remember that even our pet parents have experienced diarrhea at some point in their life. I know that maybe TMI but all of us have experienced diarrhea at some point in our lives. That’s [inaudible 00:15:54] okay?
Dr Andy Roark:
Yeah.
Dr. Callie Harris:
And I think all of us, majority of us, polled could probably emphatically say that we have not been placed on antibiotics for our diarrhea.
Dr Andy Roark:
No, solid. Yeah.
Dr. Callie Harris:
So that’s something that I would just think of first, okay? Now what the counter to that would be, “But, humans, we go to the toilet when we’re having these issues.” Our dogs, our pets, right, our fur babies, they may not be going the toilet with these issues.
Dr Andy Roark:
Maybe not.
Dr. Callie Harris:
But their toilet is outdoors. And so if we go back to categories, right, we’re talking about category one, as you identified, where Walter is letting his owner know that he’s got to go to the toilet [inaudible 00:16:38] outdoors versus him just spraying the walls, right?
Dr Andy Roark:
Yeah.
Dr. Callie Harris:
So that is what I would want to encourage you, myself because I need the same reminding, and then the rest of our vet friends out there in the world that are listening, that just understand it’s okay. It’s okay for the dog to have diarrhea a little bit longer as long as it’s not causing severe illness, causing major accidents in the home, they’re not terribly dehydrated. So just put that in the mindset, okay?
Dr. Callie Harris:
Second, there has been so much information that have come… You know, which you have probably been aware of, a lot of your listeners have been aware of, there’s been so much information that demonstrates that having or not having proper antimicrobial stewardship can absolutely make things worse for these patients, right? And so I keep that in the back of my mind.
Dr Andy Roark:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Dr. Callie Harris:
And then last, the studies, the demonstration, the utilization of a probiotic alone for these acute diarrheal cases, that information is out there. It’s out there to show that, yes, it may not happen overnight but it’s going to get better because you’re ultimately giving that pet what they need, an improvement and that shift or that imbalance in their gut, in their gut essentially.
Dr Andy Roark:
Yeah. Okay. That’s really helpful. You made me feel a lot better. You make [crosstalk 00:18:04]. No, that’s a great way to think about it and you put a lot of my concerns at ease when I go, okay, cool. And your categories make a lot of sense. That is a good way to divide the cases out for the benefit of treatmenting.
Dr. Callie Harris:
Absolutely. No, and you’re not alone, Andy. This has been something that I have had to coach myself on and there are some scenarios where, okay, go with your gut, go with your expertise, go with what has worked in the past for that specific category of patients. But I am just encouraging all of us to walk this walk and to start thinking about it differently, especially with patients like Walter.
Dr Andy Roark:
Okay. Yeah. I like this. Let’s stick with category one where Walter’s crying to go outside and things like that. How do you start treatment with this dog, right? Because I always feel compelled to try to give some sort of relief as quickly as possible to start addressing… I want to feel like I’m doing something. I want the owner to feel empowered. Talk to me about how do I actually start treatment on this dog that’s in category one, that’s wanting to go outside and I say, “I’m going to use a probiotic.” I don’t get that on board, I guess. Talk to me about that.
Dr. Callie Harris:
So if the vomiting is not as big of an issue, right, let’s say he vomited once overnight, hasn’t had any more vomiting, he’s showing interest in eating, he’s euhydrated or his hydration status is normal, then I would say, “You know what? The nausea, I feel, is under control. He’s not showing any other signs of drooling or hypersalivation or whatnot.” So then I would say, “You know what? This may take a little bit of time Mrs. Smith,” or Mr. Smith or whomever the pet parent is and say, “I’m going to send you home with this oral probiotic that I want you to start this evening, okay? Start after… Or maybe even this afternoon, after we feel confident that he’s not going to continue to vomit.”
Dr. Callie Harris:
And then I’m going to encourage them to start it with the bland diet. You know, whether that’s something that they are doing at home with the advice of their veterinarian or it is a commercially provided bland diet, either way, I’m going to make that recommendation. Start it with the next meal, preferably a bland diet and, with the particular probiotic that I utilize, it is a sachet that you open up the packet and you sprinkle it on top of the food and as long as the pet has an appetite and is not vomiting I feel perfectly fine with them starting that later that afternoon.
Dr Andy Roark:
Are, are you doing straight up full meals, like full, bland food meals or are you doing the meatball thing? And are you packing probiotic in the meatball? What does that look like?
Dr. Callie Harris:
Well, it depends on Walter, okay?
Dr Andy Roark:
Okay.
Dr. Callie Harris:
But my guess is with little Walter, the two-year-old bouncing, happy Labrador retriever, whether it’s in a meatball, a patty, or you just scoop it out on to his tray, he’s going to take it. The key is, what I coach my clients, is just to start small. It’s just like us. If we’ve been nauseous we don’t go and eat a big steak dinner, we start with something smaller. And so that’s what I would still encourage with my pet parents. Just don’t go crazy with that first meal. And I like to do a bland diet just, again, to help support what may be going on with Walter as he’s trying to get better.
Dr Andy Roark:
Do you, I’m just asking the honest question that comes in my mind, do you say, “Hey, we’re going to start this this afternoon or this evening.” Do you give a second dose the next morning? Or do you tell them, or do you say, “Nope, seriously, once every 24 hours.” Again, I have this desire to get this on board, get it going, I was like, “I want to fix this, I want to fix it fast.” Can we pop like three packets just to get started?
Dr. Callie Harris:
I’m going to tell you the truth, Andy. I have had patients that have gotten double doses of probiotic.
Dr Andy Roark:
I’m sure.
Dr. Callie Harris:
I’ve had patients go through whole boxes of probiotics. They carry a very wide safety margin but my recommendation, honestly, I like to give stuff in the morning. So let’s say Walter came in and I worked this case up on Saturday morning. I’ve given the instruction for him to get started at his next meal which may be later in the afternoon, early evening. I am perfectly fine with them transitioning to giving that probiotic every single morning. It’s once-a-day dosing, okay?
Dr Andy Roark:
Yeah.
Dr. Callie Harris:
So it’s okay, like, if they started off in the evening and then only 16 hours, if we’re splitting hairs, goes by and they start the next dose, not a problem because, again, in my mind I like morning administration of medication supplements and I think most of my clients can appreciate that too. And so that’s my typical recommendation. Get it started this afternoon or this evening and then get yourself on a day-to-day regimen starting tomorrow morning because what I want you to be comfortable with is that you don’t have to pack in as much probiotic as possible all in one hit, okay? In fact, it’s not really going to make a difference, okay? The only difference it’s going to make is that it’s going to cost our pet parents more money because they’ve now flown through all these probiotics that we sent them home with. Probiotics, the way that they work, there are a certain number of these beneficial bacteria that’s been added, right?
Dr Andy Roark:
Yeah.
Dr. Callie Harris:
And so their gut is going to do what it needs to do with the probiotic that we’re giving.
Dr Andy Roark:
Yeah. No, that makes sense. I know it’s silly but I think it’s sort of like if some is good more is probably better. And I know that’s silliness but, anyway, I just have to ask the question. How do you explain the benefits to pet owners? Do you go through the create, compete, produce sort of idea? Or do you explain it in a more simple way of, “This is going to help calm things down?” What are the words that you actually use to get them to go, “Okay, I’m on board with this”? Because I don’t want them to leave also going, “Man, I came all the way to the emergency clinic and they just gave me a probiotic. This feels like I got gypped.” I don’t want them to have that feeling so how do I help them understand and how do I help them have confidence and feel taken care of?
Dr. Callie Harris:
That’s such a good question, Andy. [ inaudible 00:24:05] I will pick my client with how deep I go into the [inaudible 00:24:10] explanation. So as a rule of thumb I think that anytime I describe a probiotic I always like to relate it to maybe something for the pet parents, right? Do you take a probiotic? Do you eat yogurt on a daily basis? And that at least gets them on the mindset of what we’re talking about. Then I go into more of a conversation of why this probiotic is going to be beneficial for this particular patient.
Dr. Callie Harris:
So I describe what’s going on with Walter. I describe what I suspect is happening at the level of his gut, why he’s having all this diarrhea. And then I have no problem giving them a little bit more knowledge on the mechanism of action of a probiotic, as long as it’s not going to confuse them. And it’s like you said, it’s going to help with their confidence in it. I think where there can be a bit of a gap is if they are already on a probiotic themselves or they do eat yogurt, then they’re thinking, “Well, can I just give what I have at home? Can I not just give Walter some yogurt?”
Dr Andy Roark:
[crosstalk 00:25:07] Yeah. Right. I’ve a hundred percent gotten that pushback. I’m not kidding. I’ll say, “Hey, we’re going to do this.” And they’re like, “Can I just give him some yogurt?” And I’m like, “No.”
Dr. Callie Harris:
We all have. Okay. And so then that’s when I go into the more specific details of the probiotic that I’m prescribing. And so all of us have a variety of probiotics that maybe we’re confident or comfortable with but I like to go with ones that are widely researched that have the quality assurance, the efficacy, the demonstrations. And so that’s what I will share with my clients too, is that not all probiotics or yogurt are going to be the same so you want to go with a strain of bacteria that you know is going to provide benefit to what we’re trying to treat. And this is a whole nother conversation, Andy, but probiotics can do so many different things from the management of gut health to immunomodulatory effects, to even neurobehavioral development. So I just try to be as simple and succinct and clear as possible that not one strain… That they’re not all the same.
Dr Andy Roark:
Right. No, that totally makes sense. Dr. Callie Harris, you are amazing. I really appreciate you talking through this with me. I gotten a lot out of this and I thoroughly enjoyed it and I love the way you think. I love how you split things into categories like that, just, man, that makes so much sense to me. I love it. So, if people are like, “Hey, this is really great. I want to continue to learn more. I want to have these resources so I can feel comfortable talking to pet owners more about probiotics and things like that,” what resources would you call out? Where would you point people?
Dr. Callie Harris:
So I have several resources but probably the one that is at the top of my list and is my jam currently right now… So everyone’s familiar with Purina?
Dr Andy Roark:
Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Dr. Callie Harris:
There is a scientific arm called Purina Institute which… We are utilizing this as a global platform where we truly believe that nutrition is better when it’s shared, these conversations, let’s take them back, let’s make sure that everyone’s on the same page in the profession, so purinainstitute.com is a great place that I will send myself as well as my colleagues to get just great information on these nutrition hot topics.
Dr Andy Roark:
That sounds fantastic. I’ll put a link down in the show notes. Thank you so much for being here. I really appreciate your time.
Dr. Callie Harris:
Absolutely. Thank you so much for having me.
Dr Andy Roark:
And that is our episode. That’s what we got for you, guys. I hope you learned something. I hope you got something out of it. I definitely did. I really like the way Callie thinks. I like the way she breaks things up into categories. That answered a lot of questions for me. I was on the fence about a couple of things and I go, “Okay, if I split it up this way, it makes sense. I’ll go this way one time and I’ll go that way the next time and then I feel good about that.” So yeah, I mean, I took some good pearls away from this conversation. I hope you did as well. Guys, take care of yourselves, be well. We’ll see you soon. Bye.
Editor: Dustin Bays
www.baysbrass.com
@Bays4Bays Twitter/Instagram
